An Audience with the Queen

Mary, Queen of Scots Home Page

Below are dramatised versions of the exchanges which took place between Mary, Queen of Scots and John Knox. Unfortunately, one is forced to rely solely on Knox's "History of the Reformation" for the truth of these. Click on the links below to jump to the various conversations.

First audience,
4 Sept. 1561
Second audience,
15Dec. 1562
Third audience,
Easter 1563
Fourth audience,
May 1563
Fifth audience,
Autumn 1563

Following anti-Catholic disturbances during Mary's first official entry into Edinburgh, the forty-seven-year old Knox was summoned to appear before the eighteen-year old Mary at the Palace of Holyroodhouse to answer four accusations. Firstly, for raising subjects against her mother and herself, secondly for writing "The First Blast...", a book against her just authority, thirdly for causing sedition and slaughter in England, and fourthly, regarding the rumour that he had used necromancy to do all this. Knox protested that he had taught people the truth and could not be blamed if they then questioned their obligation to obey their princes. As for his book, let anyone disprove the arguments in it and he would confess his error.

Mary: "Ye think, then, that I have no just authority?"

Knox: "Madam, if the realm findeth no inconvenience from the rule of a woman, then I am as well content to live under your Grace as Paul was to live under Nero. So long as ye do not persecute Protestants, neither I nor The First Blast will do your authority any harm. Besides, I wrote the book not really with you or your mother in mind, but that wicked Jezebel of England, Mary I."

Mary: "But ye speak of women in general."

Knox: "This is true Madam, however, would I have intended to make trouble in Scotland because ye are a woman, I would surely have done so before your return. As for your other two accusations, I have certainly not stirred up sedition in England. Berwick was never so peaceful as during my stay there, and those who accuse me of dabbling in the black arts are slanderers, as anyone who hath ever heard me preach can testify."

Mary: "But yet, ye have taught the people to receive another religion than their princes can allow. And how can that doctrine be of God, seeing that God commands subjects to obey their princes?"

Knox: "Princes, Madam, are often the most ignorant of all about the true religion, and numerous examples in the Old Testament prove that subjects are not bound to the religion of their princes even though they are commanded to obey them."

Mary: "Yea, but none of those men raised the sword against their princes."

Knox: "That, Madam, is because God did not give them the power to do so."

Mary: "Think ye that subjects having the power may resist their princes?"

Knox: "There is no doubt about it, Madam. Just as a children would be justified in binding and imprisoning their father if he tried to kill them, so are subjects justified in restraining and incarcerating a prince who sought to murder the children of God."

Mary stands as if amazed for more than a quarter of an hour, until Lord James comes over to see what is wrong.

Mary: "Well then, I perceive that my subjects shall obey you and not me, and shall do what they list and not what I command, and so must I be subject to them and not they to me."

Knox: "God forbid, that ever I take upon me to command any to obey me, or yet to set subjects at liberty to do what pleaseth them. My object is that both princes and subjects should obey God, who commanded kings to be foster fathers of his church and queens to be nurses of the people. Submission to divine authority bringeth no humiliation to a monarch. On the contrary, it is a source of great dignity. By submitting to the will of God and His church, they will gain everlasting glory."

Mary: "Yea, but ye are not the kirk that I will nourish. I will defend the kirk of Rome for I think it is the true kirk of God."

Knox: "Your will, Madam, is no reason, neither doth your thought make that Roman harlot to be the true and immaculate spouse of Jesus Christ. I can prove to you that the Jews who crucified Christ were not so degenerate as the Roman Catholic churchmen of their own day."

Mary: "My conscience is not so."

Knox: "Conscience, Madam, requires knowledge, and I fear that right knowledge ye have none."

Mary: "But I have both heard and read!"

Knox: "So had the Jews who crucified Christ, Madam. Ye have presumably heard only doctrines permitted by the Pope and cardinals, and they are hardly likely to allow criticism of their own church."

Mary: "Ye interpret the scriptures in one manner and they interpret in another. Whom shall I believe? And who shall be judge?"

Knox: "The word of God, Madam. The reformers condemn the Mass because it is the invention of man and nothing to do with the scriptures."

Mary: "Ye are oure sair (too difficult) for me. I wish that some of the Roman Catholic clergy I have heard were present, for they would be able to answer you."

Knox: "Indeed, Madam, I too wish that the learnedest papist in Europe were here, for at the end of our discussion, ye would realise the vanity of your religion. But the learned and crafty papist would never come and dispute in your presence, for Roman Catholics know that they cannot win an argument unless fire and sword and their own laws be judges."

An attendant enters to summon Mary to dinner.

Knox: "I pray God, Madam, that ye may be as blessed within the Commonwealth of Scotland, if it be the pleasure of God, as ever Deborah was in the Commonwealth of Israel."

Knox leaves the Queen's chamber and is asked by his friends waiting outside, what he thinks of her.

Knox: "If there be not in her proud mind, a crafty wit and an indurate heart against God and His truth, my judgment faileth me."



Knox continued to keep a close eye on Mary's activities and on 13 December 1562 preached a sermon against the vanity and ignorance of princes, criticising in particular Mary's fondness for dancing. This was in response to a malicious rumour that, upon hearing of a Roman Catholic victory in France during which her Guise uncle had been very heavy-handed, she had danced for joy all night. Knox was once more summoned to Holyroodhouse, where he found Mary with Moray, Maitland, the Earl of Morton, some of her ladies and attendants, and several of her guard. Mary accused Knox of trying to make her subjects hate her by speaking so irreverently of her, and of going far beyond the bounds of the text from which he was supposed to have been preaching.

Knox: "People who stubbornly refuse to listen to God are often punished by having to hear false rumours, Madam. Troublemakers quoted me out of context. If there be into you any sparkle of the spirit of God, yea, of honesty or wisdom, ye could not justly have been offended with anything I spake. I merely reminded people of the obedience due to kings and rulers, who are God's lieutenants, but asked what was to be done when murderers oppressed the poor saints of God, while princes were spending their time in fiddling and flinging, and listening to flatterers more than they do to men of wisdom and gravity. As for dancing, Madam, although I can find no praise of it in the scriptures, and, although the writers of classical times termed it the activity of madmen rather than of sober people, I do not utterly damn it, providing religious observance is not neglected in its favour, and as long as it is not an expression of triumph over God's people. If any man, Madam, will say that I spake more, let him presently accuse me."

Mary casts a glance in the direction of some of the guard who had given her the false reports, and turns back to Knox.

Mary: "Your words are sharp enough as ye have spoken them, but yet they were told to me in another manner. I know that my uncles and ye are not of one religion and therefore I cannot blame you, albeit you have no good opinion of them. But if ye hear anything of myself that mislikes you, come to myself and tell me, and I shall hear you."

Knox: "Your uncles, Madam, are enemies of God, ready to spill the blood of innocents for their own pomp and worldly glory. I am called, Madam, to a public function within the Kirk of God, and am appointed by God to rebuke the sins and vices of all. I am not appointed to come to every man in particular to show him his offence, for that labour were infinite. Your Grace may attend my public sermons, or arrange a time with me when I will come and repeat to you what I have preached; but to wait upon your chamber door, or elsewhere, and then to have no further liberty but to whisper my mind in your Grace's ear, or to tell you what others think and speak of you, neither will my conscience nor the vocation whereto God hath called me suffer it. Even as we speak, I am probably being criticised for being at Court and not at my book."

Mary: "Ye will not always be at your book."

On leaving the palace, Knox passes some Catholic courtiers who, seeing his cheerful expression, ask him why he is not afraid.

Knox: "Should the pleasing face of a gentlewoman effray me? I have looked in the faces of many angry men and yet have not been afraid above measure."



The eligibility of Mary for marriage was another bone of contention for Knox, who saw this as an opportunity for another Catholic prince to come and rule Scotland. When, in the Spring of 1563, various priests were arrested by the local Protestant lairds for saying Mass, Mary, who was staying at Lochleven, sent for Knox at once. When Knox arrived, Mary spent two hours trying to get him to promise that he would ensure that no one was punished for their religious observances.

Knox: "I promise, Madam, that there will be quietness throughout the country if ye punish wrongdoers according to the law. I ye do not, I fear that there are those who will take the law into their own hands."

Mary: "Will ye allow that they shall take my sword in their hand?"

Knox: "The Sword of Justice, Madam, is God's, and is given to princes and rulers for one end. If they fail in their duty and spare the wicked, then those who intervene and deal out the requisite punishment will not offend God. Nor are those who restrain kings from striking innocent men committing any sin, as numerous Biblical example demonstrate. In Scotland, judges are empowered by Act of Parliament to seek out and punish those who celebrate Mass, and it is your duty, Madam, to support them. Ye should therefore consider what it is that your subjects expect from you, and what it is that ye ought to do unto them by mutual contract. They are bound to obey you and that not but in God. Ye are bound to keep laws unto them. Ye crave of them service: they crave of you protection and defence against wicked doers. Now, Madam, if ye shall deny your duty unto them...think ye to receive full obedience of them? I fear, Madam, ye shall not."

Mary goes to supper and Knox goes to give the Earl of Moray, Mary's half-brother, an account of their interview. The next morning, probably advised by Moray, Mary invites Knox to meet her at Kinross, where she is out with her hawks. Having heard that Knox was going to Dumfries for the election of a Superintendent, she warns him about one of the candidates, Alexander Gordon, Bishop of Galloway.

Mary: "If ye knew him as well as I do, ye would never promote him to that office, nor yet to any other within your kirk. Yet, I call upon you concerning a different matter. I understand that ye have once before intervened between my half-sister, Jane Stewart Countess of Argyll and her husband the Earl of Argyll. The state of their marriage will therefore not be unfamiliar to you, and I do believe that a further interview with the Earl would be of benefit. I trust you to show discretion and not to reveal my influence in this, as I only act out of concern for the Earl. I assure you that should the Countess behave not herself so as she ought to do, she shall find no favours of me. And now, touching our reasoning yesternight, I promise to do as ye required. I shall cause summon all offenders, and ye shall know that I shall minister justice."

Knox: "I am assured then that ye shall please God, and enjoy rest and tranquillity within your realm, which to Your Majesty is more profitable than all the Pope's power can be."



When Mary's first Parliament since her return to Scotland met at the end of May 1563, nothing was done either to ratify the legislation establishing Protestantism in Scotland or the Treaty of Edinburgh. Knox was furious and quarrelled bitterly with the Earl of Moray for allowing Mary to have her way. He then preached to a large congregation, including a vicious attack against Mary's plans to marry a Catholic prince. This time, he upset the Queen as well as many of his own friends. Once more, he was summoned to appear at the Palace of Holyroodhouse. John Erskine of Dun went with him to the Queen's private cabinet, where she was waiting in a state of nervous agitation.

Mary: "I have born with you in all your rigorous manner of speaking, both against myself and against my uncles; yea, I have sought your favours by all possible means. I offered unto you presence and audience whensoever it pleased you to admonish me; and yet I cannot be quit of you. I avow to God, I shall be once revenged."

Mary bursts into tears; her page boy runs away to fetch more handkerchiefs for her to dry her eyes. Knox stands and waits uncomfortably until she has calmed down a little.

Knox: "Madam, it is true that your Grace and I have often argued in the past, but I had never noticed that I had offended you. Once God hath delivered you from the error of your ways, ye will find nothing offensive in what I have said. Indeed, I believe that outside the preaching place, few have reasons to take offence at me. In the pulpit of course, it is a different matter, for there I am not master of myself, but must obey Him who commands me to speak plain and to flatter no flesh upon the face of the earth."

Mary: "But what have ye to do with my marriage?"

Knox: "Madam, God did not send me to wait upon the Courts of princesses nor the chambers of ladies. I was sent to preach the word of God and since the nobles are so desperate for your favours that they neglect their duties, then I have to speak out."

Mary: "What have ye to do with my marriage? Or what are ye within this commonwealth?"

Knox: "A subject born within the same, Madam. And albeit I neither be Earl, Lord nor Baron within it, yet has God made me (however abject that ever I be in your eyes) a profitable member within the same. It is my duty to warn of anything which might hurt the commonwealth, and so I will repeat to you what I said from my pulpit. If the Scottish nobility were to consent that ye should be subject to an ungodly husband, they would be renouncing Christ, banishing his truth, betraying the freedom of the realm and in the end perhaps not even do any good to your Grace. There are rumours that your Grace will make a Spanish alliance. If this happens without tight restrictions being placed on you and your husband to make sure that you can do the nation nor the kirk any harm, then I will have no hesitation in denouncing as troublemakers and enemies to God those nobles who agreed to the marriage."

Mary breaks down into violent sobbing again. Erskine of Dun comes over to try and comfort her.

Knox: "Madam, in God's presence I speak. I never delighted in the weeping of any of God's creatures, yea I can scarcely well abide the tears of my own boys whom my own hand corrects, much less can I rejoice in Your Majesty's weeping. I have given you no reason to take offence, and have spoken only the truth, as my vocation compels me to do. I will therefore have to endure your tears, however unwillingly, rather than hurt my conscience or betray my commonwealth by keeping silent."

Mary: "Pray leave my chamber and wait outside."

Erskine of Dun stays behind and is joined by one of Mary's half-brothers, Lord John Stewart, who comes in to comfort her too. Knox waits anxiously in the outer chamber, ignored by the courtiers, with only Lord Ochiltree for company. An hour passes and Knox turns to a group of fashionably dressed ladies sitting nearby.

Knox: "O fair Ladies, how pleasing were this life of yours if it should ever abide and then in the end that we might pass to heaven with all this gay gear. But fie upon that Knave Death, that will come whether we will or not! The foul worms will be busy with this flesh, be it never so fair and so tender, and you will be unable to take with you your gold, your trimmings, your tassels, your pearls and precious stones."

Erskine of Dun reappears after a while and sends Knox home.



The Protestants authorities having prosecuted 22 Roman Catholics for attending Mass celebrated at Holyroodhouse while Mary was in Stirling, the Queen retaliated by having Patrick Cranstoun and Andrew Armstrong, two ringleaders of the disturbance, arrested. Knox called on the people to come and protect them on the day their trial had been fixed for, but the trial was adjourned and no further proceedings taken against the two men. Knox was called before Mary and her Privy Council. The Duke of Chatelherault, the Earl of Argyll and other council members were already in attendance, when Mary entered escorted by Maitland of Lethington and the Master of Maxwell. Mary sat down, looked at Knox and laughed exultantly.

Mary: "This is a good beginning, but know ye whereat I laugh? Yon man gart me greit and grat never tear himself. I will see if I can gar him greit." (That man made me weep and wept never a tear himself. I will see if I can make him weep)

Mary whispers to Maitland and passes him a letter.

Maitland: "This document proves that ye have been trying to raise rebellion against Her Majesty. Is this not a letter written by you on 8 October 1563, urging fellow Protestants to come to Edinburgh to defend Patrick Cranstoun and Andrew Armstrong against the summons they received?"

Knox: "My Lord, I admit having dictated and signed letters of that description, but I also gave my secretaries various blank letters signed by my hand."

Maitland: "Ye have done more than I would have done."

Knox: "Charity is not suspicious."

Mary orders him to read the letter aloud, which he does.

Mary: "Heard ye ever, my Lords, a more despiteful and treasonable letter?"

Maitland: "Do you not repent writing thus?"

Knox: "My Lord Secretary, before I repent I must be taught my offence. I have a perfect right to protect my poor flock when in danger."

Mary: "Who gave you authority to gather my subjects together? Surely ye can see that what you have done is treason!"

Ruthven: "Not so, Madam, for he gathers people together almost every day to hear his prayers and sermons. Your Grace and others may think that it amounts to treason but yet it is not."

Mary: "Hold your peace! And let him make answer for himself. I will say nothing about his religion or about his gathering people together to hear his sermons, but I want to know what authority he has to convene my subjects without my command."

Knox: "Madam, I have never convened people but merely given various notifications following the instructions of the Church, whereupon great crowds did gather, but that is no treason."

Mary: "Ye shall not escape so. Is it not treason, my Lords, to accuse a prince of cruelty? I think there be Acts of Parliament against such whisperers."

Knox: "But wherein can I be accused?"

Mary reads out part of the letter where Knox had referred to the summons as a prelude to the execution of cruelty upon a greater number.

Knox: "The obstinate Papists, Madam, are the deadly enemies of the true believers. I have done nothing to offend against the Acts of Parliament, and I did not accuse your Grace of being cruel. However, it is clear to me that the arrest of Cranstoun and Armstrong is the start of a campaign of bloody persecution of Scottish Protestants, and the pestilent Papists who have inflamed you against these poor men are the sons of the devil!"

Councillor: "Ye forget yourself! Ye are not now in the pulpit!"

Knox: "I am in the place where I am demanded of conscience to speak the truth. Her Majesty is surrounded by corrupt flatterers and deadly enemies of Christ. These men are dangerous as her own mother has found."

Maitland whispers something in Mary's ear, who controls her anger and recomposes her features.

Mary: "Ye speak fairly enough in the presence of my Lords, but the last time we met privately, ye made me greit many salt tears and ye did not care."

Knox: "As I said to you, Madam, I detest seeing anyone cry, even my own children, but I am compelled to speak the truth."

Maitland confers with Mary again and then turns to Knox.

Maitland: "Mr Knox, ye may return to your house for this night."

Knox: "I thank God and the Queen's Majesty, and Madam, I pray God to purge your heart from papistry and to preserve you from the counsel of flatterers..."

This was the last time Knox ever appeared before Mary, Queen of Scots.

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